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E85 conversion article!

Discussion in 'The Distillery' started by REX-RACER, Jul 23, 2007.

  1. REX-RACER

    REX-RACER Testing w/ the live data! Established Member

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    Yeah, I'm still harping on E85! :D

    At any rate, in that same 5.0 Mustang mag from this month there is an article starting on pg.182 about a Termi that switched over to E85 primarily for the value of the 105 octane.

    What fuel system upgrades were needed?
    - Dual Ford GT fuel pumps and 60 lb injectors. That's it, that's all! No crazy complete redesign and rebuild of the fuel system w/ teflon treated parts that were blessed by the Pope and an Excecutive order was not needed!
    - From what I've read, they needed to step up this high b/c of the extra volume you need to flow w/ E85. In my opinion this is likely overkill but it ain't bad to err on the side of being over built especially if there are future performance mods in the works!

    The tune?
    - They utilized a Diablo flip chip w/ a dedicated gasoline tune and a dedicated E85 tune.
    - Gee, where did I hear that idea before?!?!

    And the results were:
    There was no brain swelling, rectal bleeding and a kitten was not punched in the face!

    What did happen was a gain of 20 rwhp & 20 rwtq w/ help of more aggressive timing. The car came in w/ a poolie and a tune originally and laid down 446/469 w/ poolie and a tune and ended up at 465/489. Driver reported MPG on E85 was 12.6 vs 15 on the original set up running 92 octane. However the cost differential of E85 vs Premium something on the order of a reported .70c/gal so in my opinion that argument is a wash . . . and if this MPG is really that big of a deal to you, you need to get out of the performance car game and get into a Pryus!

    So is it worth it to make all of those fuel system upgrades for a 20 hp gain? Probably not . . .


    BUT, if you're sizing up a blower, turbo or even N2O where you were gonna have to upgrade the fuel system anyways and you live w/ in a reasonable distance of an E85 pump, I'd be giving this serious consideration!

    1). You can get race grade level octane straight out of a pump for about 1/8 of what you have to pay the local Torco/VP fuels guy - or as I call them, "you're local race crack dealer!

    2). If your tune up is even half-way sane, you should never have to worry about detonation ever again!

    3). You can feel all warm and fuzzy about doing something good for the environment . . . yeah I know, none of you manly men want to be associated w/ anything that wussified

    so then

    4). You can feel warm and fuzzy about promoting an American cottage industry and giving Middle Eastern oil producing conglomerates the finger while you do a wicked alcohol induced burn-out in their honor!




    . . . I'm just sayin' folks!
     
  2. quick01snake

    quick01snake Your View Established Member

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    but isn't ethanol still fairly expensive to produce vs. gasoline, and the only reason it is cheaper right now is b/c of gov't subsidies?
     
  3. 01 Venom

    01 Venom New Member Established Member

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    quick01 I believe you are right, but I am sure with anything they can perfect the process and make it cheaper.

    It was a very interesting read
     
  4. Bizarro

    Bizarro I lika do da chacha... Established Member

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    So I am assuming that the New Edges would only need the same fuel system upgrades as well (pumps/injectors)?

    Not that I'm getting ready to run out and get them...but something I would consider later down the road....
     
  5. 01 Venom

    01 Venom New Member Established Member

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    ya I would think the same upgrades would work for us
     
  6. Bizarro

    Bizarro I lika do da chacha... Established Member

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    Like I said, not like I am going to run out and do it...but later on, it might be an option as E85 becomes (possibley) more available and cheaper.
     
  7. 01 Venom

    01 Venom New Member Established Member

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    it may become cheaper, but the octane rating is very high so your fuel miles will go down with it, so it may balance out.

    But... would be cheaper then buying race gas maybe
     
  8. Mt Twigbert

    Mt Twigbert Member Established Member

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    I read that for every one gallon of ethanol made it takes close to three gallons of water.. And if ethanol ever becomes the primary fuel for the U.S. we'd drain our great lakes in no time trying to keep up w/ demand..

    Don't quote me or anything.. It was just an article on the down side of ethanol and how its not the end all solution for replacing oil.. Kinda made me think..
     
  9. 01 Venom

    01 Venom New Member Established Member

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    Ya I agree that right now it doesnt look like the savior of the planet. But the process can be perfected and revised I am sure.
     
  10. Janstang

    Janstang Guest

    FWIW, when I'm not running race gas in mine I use E85. Consumption is higher with the E85, but nothing that gets me too worked up. I don't use it for racing right now primarily because of the extra fuel needed with E85 to keep it Stoich. I noticed that with the FAST wideband on the market currently that they have a Ethanol/Methanol compatible sensor to tune with. Not sure on the cost, but I may buy one just to tune for the ethanol. I have a pilot I talk to often that flies for the ethanol guys and he keeps bugging me to go talk to them about racing with ethanol, and helping them spread the word(sponsorship most likely).
     
  11. REX-RACER

    REX-RACER Testing w/ the live data! Established Member

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    Is that at the Verasun plant up there? My soon to be in-laws tell me that's about an hour away from them. If you could work a deal for sponsorship I'd be all over it in a heart beat! Nothin' like go fast parts paid for by someone else!
     
  12. REX-RACER

    REX-RACER Testing w/ the live data! Established Member

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    That would be call American ingenuity . . . you know, that whole "can do" attitude thing that put a man on the moon. Seems to be sadly absent the last few decades or so . . .
     
  13. BOOGIE MAN

    BOOGIE MAN Logic and Reason Established Member

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    look I'm sorry to do it, just one of my pet peeves.

    What in the hell is a poolie and why should I take advice from someone who uses that word?
     
  14. MikeW

    MikeW ......................... Established Member

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    :lol: I poolie must be a poodle/collie mix :shrug:


    I would like the E85 105 octane but want to see more info on the subject before I run out and convert.
     
  15. REX-RACER

    REX-RACER Testing w/ the live data! Established Member

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    Poolie = a lower ratio supercharger drive pulley on a Terminator Cobra. It's just a term some folks in my local club use.

    I'm sorry the term offends some people so much, but if you're going to use that as the cornerstone of an argument to discount everything I've been saying about E85 conversion for the last several months, you were probably never that interested in the first place.

    It's not necessary to discredit the source, "He said 'poolie'! hehe hehe hehehe!"

    I'm just presenting the facts as I've uncovered them having done a good bit of homework on the subject. You don't have to listen to me, anyone can look this stuff up themselves.
     
  16. REX-RACER

    REX-RACER Testing w/ the live data! Established Member

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    Here's a good place to start:

    http://www.svtperformance.com/forums/showthread.php?t=381030&highlight=e85

    There's a ton of links to supporting evidence and data that speaks for itself.
     
  17. Janstang

    Janstang Guest

    I'm not sure. They fly out a couple times a week to the various plants they have and do whatever. Next time I see him I will ask. I didn't realize how many ethanol plants are on the east side of the state. My brother is driving truck hauling the by product(crush corn) to the various dairy farms down around Sioux Falls and says he knows of 5 just around Sioux Falls. That doesn't include the Watertown area. They are getting ready to build one up north of us over here on the west side of the state, but it's been rumored that one may do swichgrass or something along those lines. We have about 3 different gas stations locally that carry the E85 and it usually averages 30-40cents cheaper/gallon. Get on the east side of the state and its even cheaper with all the ethanol plants around.
     

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