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CA legal midpipe - stock H vs. magnaflow catted x and HPDE

Discussion in 'Exhaust' started by srdigital, Jun 11, 2019.

  1. srdigital

    srdigital Member Established Member

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    So, CA emissions laws are garbage, and I'd also like to limit the things I have to do to the car to prep it in between daily driving and driving events. That being said, I've heard only anecdotally that the stock cats might not stand up to HPDEs. I haven't been able to find anything in the way of direct observation, though.

    my question would be if the stock cats can hold up to multiple driving events, or if perhaps the magnaflow CA legal catted X would be acceptable? purpose being to be legal on the street and not have to swap to an O/R or high-flow cats just for track duty.
    link: MagnaFlow Direct-Fit Catalytic Converters 441114

    I like the magnaflow as it's 2.5" and stainless and has an x instead of an H, too.

    thanks for any input
     
  2. nxhappy

    nxhappy Well-Known Member Established Member

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    usually it's boost/high heat/high HP that will blow the cats. Stock to mild HP should be no problem. IMO just go catless...and then in 2 years swap back to stock for the test...
     
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  3. cartec

    cartec Member Established Member

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    You are correct that you can get high performance, free flowing and low emissions exhaust system that is legal in California. I have a Magnaflow system on my 99 Cobra, and it passed with flying colors which included extremely low emission measurements. It sounds great to boot; it’s not lose your hearing loud, but others will know you have a excellent sounding high horsepower V-8 under the hood. :)

    For my own edification, I did a quick google search that pointed me to this ...

    California Air Resources Board - Wikipedia

    Look for an exhaust system that is CARB approved and an has an EO(executive order) number on the part. Show that to the smog station, and it will pass because it will be within the law.

    Some of the old timers here might remember when lead was still in the gas and no emissions equipment caused ones eyes to burn while also exposing everyone to airborne lead. Mad Hatter anyone?

    I’m just glad all the manufacturers offer parts to reduce emissions while making great performance, so we can continue to enjoy cars while balancing air quality at a price that is sorta affordable.

    Ford has the excellent coyote engine that can meet the standards and (gasp, hiss, boo if you are a die hard Ford fan) the other guys offer a thing called an E-rod engine I’ve been told.

    And I am also glad these same manufacturers go through the sometimes onerous process of qualifying their parts too. There is room for improvement in that process for sure.

    I hope that helps. Best, T
     
  4. srdigital

    srdigital Member Established Member

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    I'm increasingly nervous of the new modified exhaust laws as I commute in it daily. I have a VRS high-flow catted x currently, and a Mac O/R x but I like the idea of not having to play that game every 2 years.
     
  5. srdigital

    srdigital Member Established Member

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    was it by chance the system I linked to? or was it another?

    thanks, t! very helpful.
     
  6. nxhappy

    nxhappy Well-Known Member Established Member

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    LOL you work at the ARB ? Are you a nark ? GTFO
     
  7. cartec

    cartec Member Established Member

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    No ... to both questions.

    Look at my other posts to understand who I am.

    I’m old enough and lucky enough to have taken auto shop in a California high school where I did an 85 GT engine and t-5 trans swap into a 79 Foxbody for my first car.

    The 99 Cobra with the IRS and 4.6 32 valve is more refined although I still like the foxbodies.

    Best,T
     
  8. cartec

    cartec Member Established Member

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  9. nxhappy

    nxhappy Well-Known Member Established Member

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    naw. old timers don't like cats and Kali smog laws. I call bullshit.
     
  10. cartec

    cartec Member Established Member

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    So you want the lead back in gas? Ha!

    I was only trying to help the guy with his questions, and I get called a jerk. I’m going to think about wether I want to participate at this site anymore.

    I’m done with this site. No more posts. Bye.
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2020
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  11. 01yellercobra

    01yellercobra AKA slo984now Established Member

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    If you're tuned make sure the protections for the cats are still turned on. I think part of the issue is the protections are turned off when making big power so the cats take a beating.
     
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  12. srdigital

    srdigital Member Established Member

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    I ended up finding a brand new Magnaflow 441114 for about 40% off on ebay. I got it outside of ebay through the seller to avoid ebay fees. their advertising was pretty odd, as they were selling it below MAP. map is a minimum price set by the manufacturer, basically fixing the bottom pricing that any authorized distributor can advertise or list it at.

    seller was legit, was a huge Magnaflow rep and had it dropped shipped direct from manufactuere and was here 2 days after buying it.


    so, a some quick notes:
    - CA smog legal
    - high-flow cats
    - 2.5" all the way with an x-pipe
    - stainless
    - high-quality, well made

    I had a VRS catted x-pipe into borla stingers. i'm an audio engineer for a living, and I commute in the car with ear plugs. it was raspy, obnoxiously loud, way too much drone at 2k (70mph on the freeway). when downshifting, it got sputtery/pops/clicks with both the VRS and the stock mid. I thought I hated the stingers.

    rasp is now gone, the stingers are now 97% tone and 3% drone. I can stomp on it (or midnight taco bell run) and not wake up the whole neighborhood. it sounds refined to me. conversations can be had in the cabin without raising your voice. sputtering is totally gone, it just growls on a downshift like it should. I am 100% keeping the stingers now, and I think I've found an excellent, low-maintenance medium that doesn't sacrifice much.


    I would have been hard-pressed to pay full price (especially since I have a functional stock midpipe), but this exceeded all my expectations and I consider it money well spent. car is a daily driver with several track events a year, and I plan on never having to switch this thing out, regardless of the duty it sees.

    my mpg is definitely going to take a hit, considering I can hit it more aggressively without it sounding irresponsibly loud.
     
  13. 01yellercobra

    01yellercobra AKA slo984now Established Member

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    I wonder what kind of shape the cats were in the VRS? The original cats in my Bassani slowly disintegrated and the car got louder each time. One morning I fired it up and there was a pop and suddenly it was really loud. I had the Stingers at the time as well. That lasted about a week before I ordered replacement cats.

    I'm currently on the stock mid pipe with the Stingers. It's not bad, but it just has a weird tone to me. I'll probably put the Bassani back on in the next couple months.
     
  14. SilverGT1

    SilverGT1 Active Member Established Member

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    2003 GT

    I know that this thread is pretty old. Hopefully the OP, or anyone else that has the Magnaflow 441114, is still around. I just ordered a set and tried to install today. There is major issues. I am not quite sure if it is all related to the passenger side cat or the x-pipe or both. I think they sent me the wrong set. Driver side seems to locate ok.

    On the passenger side, the pre-cat is super close to the starter and bell housing. But the real problem is that the flange of the second cat actually overlaps onto the subframe connector.

    Passenger Side Cat to Frame - Overlapping to subframe connector
    49125993391_32db78050a_m.jpg

    Driver Side Cat to subframe connector - looks OK
    49126178377_f845434099_m.jpg

    Next issue is that the x-pipe is nowhere near matching up with my rear exhaust. It is WAY off.

    Rear Exhaust Offset
    49126178137_ce1bf83763_m.jpg

    Next issue is that the x-pipe is like they assembled it backward (left to right flipped) but the lengths to the rear exhaust portion would still be wrong. Look at the following pics. Passenger side is fully engaged and the driver side barely inserts.

    Driver side x-pipe to cat
    49125503713_1aea740455_m.jpg

    Passenger side x-pipe to cat
    49125503608_7b2479a2c1_m.jpg


    Did any of you have any issues like this?
     
  15. srdigital

    srdigital Member Established Member

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    I had similar-ish fitment issues. not nearly as extreme. I used several scissor jacks (the kind that come with the car in the spare well) and manhandled everything into place. my driver's side rear cat is sloppily clocked from the factory - the inside flange of the shield sits higher than the outside edge. I had to get in place best as possible, and rotate it where it needed to be. the jacks made it possible. my best advice is to get it together and everything loose and work it as you go.

    mine was maybe 7.5 or 8/10 as far as 'out of the box' fitment goes . . . I will say that I really, really love them. good tone, definitely tamed, but able to have a conversation in the car still.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2019
  16. SilverGT1

    SilverGT1 Active Member Established Member

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    Problem is, driver side seems ok but, as you know, the passenger side header flange is welded in place. Once that is bolted up, it is what it is. It can’t be moved.
     
  17. SilverGT1

    SilverGT1 Active Member Established Member

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    Some more info. Pulled the Magnaflow out to measure against the stock and Magnaflow 2-Cat x-pipe 93335.
    1) Both the stock and MF 93335 measure about 20.5" center to center at the middle of the bottom cat. The Magnaflow is about 22.5".
    2) The clocking of the Magnaflow pre-cat on the passenger side is way different than stock. Stock is roughly straight up and down, we'll say 0*. The Magnaflow is clocked at about, roughly, 22*. Explains the tight fit to the starter and bellhousing.

    If you look at the picks, you can see how the Magnaflow has a bend at the bottom of the passenger side pre-cat that angles the bottom cat out toward the passenger side.

    I am not sure how they got this so messed up. It is supposed to be direct factory fit.


    Center to Center - Stock Pipe
    C to C stock pipe.JPG

    Center to Center - MF 93335
    C to C BBK.JPG

    Center to Center - Magnaflow
    C to C Magnaflow.JPG

    Stock passenger side pre-cat clocking
    passenger stock cat clock .JPG

    Magnaflow passenger side pre-cat clocking
    passenger magnaflow cat clock 1.JPG
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2019
  18. SilverGT1

    SilverGT1 Active Member Established Member

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    I have been working with Magnaflow on this. They are trying to get it sorted out. I've pointed out to them that their 93335 2-Cat fits perfectly. Hopefully, this will end up with a better fitting 441114 product. I'll update when the new parts arrive.
     
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  19. big dad

    big dad Well-Known Member Established Member

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    You won't be alone.
     
  20. SilverGT1

    SilverGT1 Active Member Established Member

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    For what it is worth, it took forever for Magnaflow to get my replacement 441114 to me. Short story, it fit and I am happy. Only gripe is that the what they position the passenger side pre-cat is odd. Makes clearance an issue. Maybe because they are selling these for 2V and 4V? Anyway, all is well.
     
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