Brother trying to join the Military. Need advice.

[Branhammer]

My little brother is trying to join the military. I did four years active duty Air Force and I really liked it. I only got out and went Guard so I could settle down here in SLC with my wife. She has a Masters and a great job, so I wasn't about to make her follow an enlisted guy around. Now I have a great full-time job with the Utah ANG and have roots here. Joining was the best decision I've ever made. I'm trying to help my brother get his life on track by joining. That being said, I only have first hand knowledge of the AF, so that's the direction I've tried to push him. But maybe he should consider other branches as well. Here's a little about him.

He is one of those "late bloomers." That's best case scenario too, I think. He's 26, lives with our dad in El Paso, has very little stable work experience, and pretty much just plays video games all the time. I think he's had two jobs that he stayed with for more than a few months. He has no formal education. He's the type of kid that will not take initiative to get up and do something, but if you ask him to he immediately says "sure thing" and gets right up and does it. It's just that he needs to be told first.

I don't want to see him still living with our dad at age 30, still having done nothing with his life. The family coddles him and enables him to do nothing. I'm the only one who is straight up with him and calls him on his crap. He REALLY wants to join. He's been working with an Air Force recruiter down there for about a year. He was pretty overweight when he started talking to the recruiter. He was about 6'0" and 275 lbs. The recruiter told him that he needed to get down to 208 lbs. to get in. To my disbelief, he actually busted his ass and got down below his goal weight. He's been at the goal weight for three months now and the recruiter seems to be just giving him the run-around. Maybe he doesn't like his personality. Maybe he thinks he's lazy (he is). But I saw recruits worse than my brother turn their lives around in the Air Force. I want the same for him and he wants it.

I'd say there's a good chance he's one of those kids the military could make a man out of and he could finally start a career. But there's also a chance he won't make it through basic. There are some people you just don't know about until they try.

This AF recruiter for some reason is not on top of trying to get my brother in, so I'm wondering if he should think about talking to other branches. I will say that I know a lot of guys that have been army, and every single one of them is either out doing nothing now or crossed over to the AF. I don't know anyone in the Navy currently.

Anyone in the Army/Navy that can share your thoughts, opinions, and experiences with the branch you serve?

 

[mattaglover]

If the one recruiter isnt working with you just find another one or if he really wants in the force he should bug the hell out of them. If that recruiter is filling spots hes not going to go out of his way to put a guy in like your brother. If he doesnt finish basic the recruiter will loose that contract. That looks bad on him.

Im a Marine but have done some ship time. It doesnt look like a very fun job. It looks like the enlisted are the officers b*tch.

I wouldnt even consider the army. Leave it at that.

 

[ZYBORG]

Based on what you told me, seems like the AF would be the best fit for him. If his current recruiter is not hustling to get him in, find another that will (recruiters are like car salesmen).

USMC is definitely out of the question and he would also likely get chewed and spit out in the ARMY as well.

Navy might he an option, but I could never do a ship.

 

[Branhammer]

I met Navy personnel when I was in Iraq that said being in the Navy doesn't mean you have to spend time on a ship. Those guys were in the middle of the desert for deployment. I've heard if you pick the right job you will never set foot on a ship. That could all be BS though. And yeah I don't think he'd make it in the Army and especially not the Marines. Truth be told, it might even be better for him to join the ANG or reserves. That could at least get him some experience to open some doors later on.

I don't know. It's just hard to watch your brother do nothing at that age.

As far as working with a different recruiter, he said he tried to call one in another town nearby and was told he can only go to the one that he lives near. As if they're a cable company or something...

 

[mattaglover]

He just needs to go in there and say I want to enlist now. If he meets all requirements than keep on them until he ships.
Military is very competitive now and they dont want people they need to work to get.
The navy jobs that work on land would be way out of his league.

 

[04SloSnake]

What does he want to do in the military? That should weigh more in his decision than anything else to be honest because people do better when they enjoy what they do. I think there have been a lot of basic generalizations in this thread though regarding his potential success in any of the branches. They all have the same things that will get you in trouble and they all have standards. I've been doing the Marine thing for quite a while but I have worked closely with every branch both in garrison and in country. I honestly don't think he would succeed in one and not another based on how "challenging" it is, I think it all depends on his actual MOS.

Typically, and I do say typically, Marines have more pride in their service which might be just what he needs to kick himself in the ass. That might just be something for him to think about. If he has any questions I would be more than willing to give him an unbiased opinion of my experiences. But I cannot stress it enough, he needs to figure out what job he wants to do.

 

[1 Alibi 2]

Has you brother been tested ?
I know the Navy, ( retired ), will test you & tell you what jobs you're qualified to do.
Unless it's changed, the needs of the Navy come first.
If they need to fill billets in a certain field, & that is what he wants to do & is qualified to do that job, that's where they put you.
.
Regardless of what branch of service, anything he is promised, that isn't in writing, doesn't exist.

 

[SOVACobra03]

I vote AF as well and I'm active duty army. Army is constant deployments in a dog eat dog world.

 

[smashedheadcat]

The Marines will chew him up and spit him out. That could be the motivation he needs though. (GySgt USMC - Active)

 

[04SloSnake]

The Marines will chew him up and spit him out. That could be the motivation he needs though. (GySgt USMC - Active)

Everyone is saying this, but I cannot jump behind this opinion. I have had good junior Marines and I have had bad, but you never know how they were before getting in. 13 weeks is plenty of time to turn someone around, especially at that age. That being said it could go either way.

- A fellow SNCO

 

[Branhammer]

As of right now, he's saying he wants to follow in my footsteps as an avionics technician. He would also go aircraft electrician, as it's very similar. I'm no longer in that field but I did enjoy it. But personally, I think he'd do best in a job like cyber surety or something else dealing with computers. Or even MOF Analysis, which is what I'm doing now. I think a desk job would suit him best. Even finance or personnel. But I do think the AF is probably the way to go for him.

 

[saleensc281]

Honest opinion? I would consider joining todays military as a last resort.

 

[mattaglover]

Why do you say that?

 

[saleensc281]

Why do you say that?

It's because I've been in too long. I have have seen a lot of transitions throughout the years. In my opinion the transitions have severely degraded today's miltary. Too many leaders, to include senior leaders do not have the experience to effectively lead Soldiers, based on the rapid promotion rates due to the 13+ years of war. Due to that new Soliders tend to suffer, although today's Soldiers are part of the entitlement generation where they want to question everything and do nothing. The latter of those are starting to make their way through the ranks as well. It doesn't take much for a bad leader to ruin a good Soldier. Ever hear the term it will get worse before it gets better? Looks at the suicide and sexual assault rate in the military it's alarming and involves all ranks. In my opionion it's just not a good place to be. Back in the day...sure, but now....no. Like I said I'm old school, I'm sure the younger generation feels differently, just because they know no different.

 

[saleensc281]

Case in point, from reading the OP initial post....recruiter giving him the run around after he busted his ass to get his weight down. That is the type of leaders that are in today's military. Leaders that don't know and/or don't give a crap about Soldiers. Is that really a organization you want to join? I know I wouldnt.

 

[mattaglover]

Im assuming your army. I agree the new generations comes with its problems. To say the military is going down hill in completely wrong. If anything its getting better. Standards are higher than ever and the weak ones being put out at the rapid rate, at least in the Marine Corps. I am sure the army's standards are quiet a bit lower. I have also been around a long time and understand the old school thoughts. Females trying to be a Marine grunt so on so forth but standards are what matter as long as people keep them.
Lets see what happens with the next guy in office. Then we can form an official opinion on the direction the military is going.

 

[saleensc281]

How long have you been in? I have experience on my side, and it tells me it's going down hill. You are entitled to your opinion, but you can't ignore the facts....regardless of branch. If you want to be the one carrying the torch, so be it, but Im done. Two years and I'm out. I can't stomache the military's current state.

 

[saleensc281]

I am Army, and it may be different in the Marines, but a lot of the problems are not branch specific.

 

[svtfocus2cobra]

My opinion is that the standards are down right now and I'm speaking from Marine Corps infantry. I think this is due to the mentality of the Marines that are still joining at this time. They are joining to go fight a war which they won't get to do and they soon realize that when they hit their first unit and hear that they will be going on ship or to Oki for deployment with no Afghanistan or Syria in sight. When I was a squad leader with 3/1 keeping guys motivated with a combat mindset was extremely difficult because they were privileged to just as much information you were so they knew if they were in harms way or not, and that did affect their attitudes overall.

I and many of my peers were big advocates against this pussification that was taking place by the higher ups who were making examples of anyone who went against the new standards that were coming down the chain. Everything was hazing. Even if you humiliated someone the wrong way you might be brought in for questioning about your intentions. That's bullshit! We knew what kept the gears greased in the command which was an old-corps mentality. That's what these guys were here for... to live a hard life and to be hardened, but higher did all they could to prevent that or at least oversee it which was counterproductive.

And sure enough, 5 months out of the Marines my buddy Alec who was a newly promoted Cpl right before he got out and one of our most infamous gets a text from our LT who was now Co Cmdr asking how to get everyone motivated again. He said no one there cares anymore and no one wants to try, it's basically all a joke to the enlisted Marines. He admitted we were right in wanting to live by old school standards because without it guys got comfortable knowing they weren't going to get their asses kicked and were safe from that kind of treatment. Our LT said it's regulations coming down from no lower than Division and that the Battalion is just as frustrated as the companies, but they have no real options.

So, we are either looking at a generational struggle in that we have a generation of warriors stuck in a job that will no longer allow them to be warriors, or we have a government and higher military actively seeking to weaken the fighter spirit of the branches. I get that discipline is a good thing but the mentality I saw was not that of an organization ready to fight, but rather one trying to avoid confrontation from overseeing entities.

 

[Branhammer]

It's because I've been in too long. I have have seen a lot of transitions throughout the years. In my opinion the transitions have severely degraded today's miltary. Too many leaders, to include senior leaders do not have the experience to effectively lead Soldiers, based on the rapid promotion rates due to the 13+ years of war. Due to that new Soliders tend to suffer, although today's Soldiers are part of the entitlement generation where they want to question everything and do nothing. The latter of those are starting to make their way through the ranks as well. It doesn't take much for a bad leader to ruin a good Soldier. Ever hear the term it will get worse before it gets better? Looks at the suicide and sexual assault rate in the military it's alarming and involves all ranks. In my opionion it's just not a good place to be. Back in the day...sure, but now....no. Like I said I'm old school, I'm sure the younger generation feels differently, just because they know no different.

I was not around in what you might call the "good old days" as I joined in 2008, but I have supervisors here that were. And yes, it sounds great. Sounds like it's gone down hill a bit. But I LOVE where I am currently. I liked being part of CSAR maintenance when I was AD as well. The military is the best job I've ever had and I had a bachelors before that. The only jobs with any earning potential I've seen on the civilian side with a degree not related to medical or engineering are sales jobs. I don't like commission jobs. Too unstable. When I got out of active duty I had avionics experience and my associate's in AV Systems Technology and was doing the one weekend a month thing for the ANG. Those two things have gotten me more job offers here in SLC than my BA got me anywhere before I joined. I've been offered jobs up at Hill AFB, jobs with airlines, and worked for L-3 Comm for a year and a half before I got my Air Technician job here with the ANG. The military was the best job I ever had and I recommend the Air Force to people all the time. Yes, there are some crappy leaders and crappy, lazy troops, but if you get a job you are interested in and work hard, you'll go far in the AF. The only problems I have are bad leaders that allow lazy troops to stay in and average troops to advance more quickly by kissing ass. But the hard workers generally make rank as well. I know a lot of damn good leaders back in my previous AD squad and it gives me hope for the future, at least for that particular CSAR unit. If I could go back, the only thing I'd do differently is hold out a little longer for an officer slot in OTS instead of enlisting. But I'm very happy with everything the AF has done for me.

As far as my brother, it really feels like this IS his last resort. Also, I feel like the disciplinary aspect of the military would do him a lot of good. He needs someone to kick him in the ass and make him understand that you can't spend hours and hours a day doing nothing. When he was working full-time he'd always tell me he's been "so busy." His idea of busy is working 40 hours a week and nothing more. He knows nothing of life as of yet.