2013 GT500 Track/Perf Package vs. 2013 Boss LS - Primarily for Road Racing Ability?

[Silver TT]

Trying to decide on the next horse in the stable and whether it should be a 2013 Boss or 2013 GT500. Obviously very different cars but given they are reasonably close in price and both very special Mustangs, I thought I'd ask some of you guys your opinions on choosing one or the other.

I've also seen some FS postings of guys with twin screw Boss' with $20k in aftermarket parts and 3k miles who are trading them in for 2013 GT500s which just doesn't seem to make any sense to me given a Boss with a twin screw and 685 rwhp will easily blow away a 2013 GT500 in a straight line and also on a race track.

I love the idea of a factory warranty with 650hp but if its heavier and doesn't handle as well - even with the adjustable bilsteins - then I am going with the Boss and will likely do a twin screw or Vortech (whichever is superior for road racing).

Articles like this are somewhat persuading me towards Boss so would love opinions of guys who have driven both.

2012 Chevrolet Camaro ZL1 vs 2013 Ford Shelby GT500 - On Track - Automobile Magazine

 

[Devious_Snake]

Im a future GT500 owner, car is on its way...and my honest opinion is if I wanted a car for road racing, I would get a Boss 302LS

Im getting the GT500 because it can do it all, but its more refined and offers more of that grand touring type vehicle, that will smoke almost anything on the street and can be used for the once in a blue HPDE session. Thats not to say you couldnt just do a nice griggs suspension on it and smoke everyone on the road course but for serious track duty, I would do bolt ons on the boss and have at it...thats just my .02 though

 

[ON D BIT]

The GT500 will be faster one lap on one lap off. For thirty minute sessions the Boss will be throwing up very consistent time throughout!

 

[rwboring]

Trying to decide on the next horse in the stable and whether it should be a 2013 Boss or 2013 GT500. Obviously very different cars but given they are reasonably close in price and both very special Mustangs, I thought I'd ask some of you guys your opinions on choosing one or the other.

I've also seen some FS postings of guys with twin screw Boss' with $20k in aftermarket parts and 3k miles who are trading them in for 2013 GT500s which just doesn't seem to make any sense to me given a Boss with a twin screw and 685 rwhp will easily blow away a 2013 GT500 in a straight line and also on a race track.

I love the idea of a factory warranty with 650hp but if its heavier and doesn't handle as well - even with the adjustable bilsteins - then I am going with the Boss and will likely do a twin screw or Vortech (whichever is superior for road racing).

Articles like this are somewhat persuading me towards Boss so would love opinions of guys who have driven both.

2012 Chevrolet Camaro ZL1 vs 2013 Ford Shelby GT500 - On Track - Automobile Magazine

im not sure if either are "superior" for road racing... blower=heat soak... not saying it won't be faster.

on a separate note... forget that article

 

[Filthy1]

Boss without a doubt.

 

[bpmurr]

Even a regular Boss would be a better fit for road racing. Some of the LS "advantages" can be taken care of for less than the price difference between the cars.

 

[Van@RevanRacing]

Trying to decide on the next horse in the stable and whether it should be a 2013 Boss or 2013 GT500. Obviously very different cars but given they are reasonably close in price and both very special Mustangs, I thought I'd ask some of you guys your opinions on choosing one or the other.

I've also seen some FS postings of guys with twin screw Boss' with $20k in aftermarket parts and 3k miles who are trading them in for 2013 GT500s which just doesn't seem to make any sense to me given a Boss with a twin screw and 685 rwhp will easily blow away a 2013 GT500 in a straight line and also on a race track.

I love the idea of a factory warranty with 650hp but if its heavier and doesn't handle as well - even with the adjustable bilsteins - then I am going with the Boss and will likely do a twin screw or Vortech (whichever is superior for road racing).

Articles like this are somewhat persuading me towards Boss so would love opinions of guys who have driven both.

2012 Chevrolet Camaro ZL1 vs 2013 Ford Shelby GT500 - On Track - Automobile Magazine

I have driven GT500's with normal mod suspension and complete Griggs Chassis set ups. I have also driven the Boss 302 LS at Daytona.

You are essentially talking about supercharging a Boss which will create additional heat in the engine just like a GT500 with a PD blower.

This weekend I will be running my 2013 in Time Trial at Sebring to "get the feel"

I will tell you that my honest opinion is that both cars are excellent with great ergonomics. The Boss feels awesome and so does the 2013 GT500.

If your intent is to Road Race constantly and you're running Time Trials or another level of advanced road course driving the Boss will class a little lower and allow you to be more competitive with similar classed vehicles.

The 2012 GT500 classes out with NASA Time Trial as "SUR" which means it hasn't been classed as of yet so it falls into TTS, TTU or TTR. 2013 GT500 will easily class out to TTU or TTR. So I'm running TTR this weekend. Not trying to win anything just getting a feel for the car.

If you're only going to run intermediate or advanced road course HPDE events a few times a year I would probably go with the GT500 because you'll get great enjoyment out of the car on the road course on those track weekends and then daily driving on the street with just a couple of easy mods to the 2013 you've got an awesome street machine and a great weekend track car.

Van

 

[Van@RevanRacing]

Trying to decide on the next horse in the stable and whether it should be a 2013 Boss or 2013 GT500. Obviously very different cars but given they are reasonably close in price and both very special Mustangs, I thought I'd ask some of you guys your opinions on choosing one or the other.

I've also seen some FS postings of guys with twin screw Boss' with $20k in aftermarket parts and 3k miles who are trading them in for 2013 GT500s which just doesn't seem to make any sense to me given a Boss with a twin screw and 685 rwhp will easily blow away a 2013 GT500 in a straight line and also on a race track.

I love the idea of a factory warranty with 650hp but if its heavier and doesn't handle as well - even with the adjustable bilsteins - then I am going with the Boss and will likely do a twin screw or Vortech (whichever is superior for road racing).

Articles like this are somewhat persuading me towards Boss so would love opinions of guys who have driven both.

2012 Chevrolet Camaro ZL1 vs 2013 Ford Shelby GT500 - On Track - Automobile Magazine

I have driven GT500's with normal mod suspension and complete Griggs Chassis set ups. I have also driven the Boss 302 LS at Daytona.

You are essentially talking about supercharging a Boss which will create additional heat in the engine just like a GT500 with a PD blower.

This weekend I will be running my 2013 in Time Trial at Sebring to "get the feel"

I will tell you that my honest opinion is that both cars are excellent with great ergonomics. The Boss feels awesome and so does the 2013 GT500.

If your intent is to Road Race constantly and you're running Time Trials or another level of advanced road course driving the Boss will class a little lower and allow you to be more competitive with similar classed vehicles.

The 2012 GT500 classes out with NASA Time Trial as "SUR" which means it hasn't been classed as of yet so it falls into TTS, TTU or TTR. 2013 GT500 will easily class out to TTU or TTR. So I'm running TTR this weekend. Not trying to win anything just getting a feel for the car.

If you're only going to run intermediate or advanced road course HPDE events a few times a year I would probably go with the GT500 because you'll get great enjoyment out of the car on the road course on those track weekends and then daily driving on the street with just a couple of easy mods to the 2013 you've got an awesome street machine and a great weekend track car.

Van

 

[GTCobraClone]

I remember hearing that there would be 3 versions of the Boss 302, the regular one, the LS, and there was another one that was just for Road Racing. Anyone know if they are going to make the race version?

 

[Chris!]

I remember hearing that there would be 3 versions of the Boss 302, the regular one, the LS, and there was another one that was just for Road Racing. Anyone know if they are going to make the race version?

The 302S is what you are thinking of

 

[GTCobraClone]

The 302S is what you are thinking of

Thats the one, looked it up and found this comparison between the 302S and the 302R.

Compare the Mustang BOSS 302R and Mustang BOSS 302S - Side By Side Comparison - Ford Racing Performance Parts

 

[Ry_Trapp0]

you should've put the camaro ZL1 in the poll so i could intentionally not vote for the "fastest" car on the list, because the boss 302 is simply a 100% unquestionably better track car - regardless of the track times. vorshlag motorsports has been running a 2011 mustang GT for a while now and one of their recent events was one of the 'optima face off' events. here's an excerpt of one portion of the track event from their write up...

"Top Ten Track Shoot-out

This was another non-points event they held, run after the day's "BFG Hot Lap Challenge" track time was done. The ten fastest cars were called up to the grid, lined from fastest to slowest, and they wanted us to make a 5 lap sprint to the checkered flag. The announcer said it was all about getting to the flag first, and I tried to ask someone on pit road if this was indeed the case. Ed was talking to me on the phone during the whole session again, and passing along lap times, announcer's and crowd's feedback, etc. As far as we knew it was about working your way up through the pack and getting to the finish line first. They lined up Lewis' ZR1 in front, then the LPE Camaro was supposed to be 2nd (but it caught on fire late in the day, then was pouring transmission fluid onto the exhaust by now and wasn't allowed to run) so they moved me up from 3rd place. The rest of the field was behind me, but all I had eyes for was the ZR1 Corvette. They sent us out 15 seconds apart, and we were supposed to NOT pass on the out lap (yellow flag out lap were the rules for the day), but after the green flag dropped it was on.

I tore ass through pit-out and was catching the ZR1 by turn 3. I knew how each of the top 10 cars were performing from running so many sessions that day - everyone was running hot, taking cool down laps, or only making 1-2 lap sessions. I felt like I could push the Mustang 10/10ths on a 5 lap sprint without slowing down more than a second from my fastest time all day. Driving Flat Out for each lap wouldn't make for the fastest peak time, but it could allow me to pass faster cars. And the only one faster left was the ZR1. So on the out lap I hauled ass, caught up to Loise's Corvette, and painted his mirrors red with Mustang. I wasn't going to pass him on the warm up lap, but I was letting him know I was back here. "Hi, Louis!" He saw me swerving back and forth, as I was baiting him to push it hard on the out lap. That boosted ZR1 had about 1 fast lap in it, but the Mustang could lay down 5 heaters...

He fell for it by turn 5, put the hammer down, and we were in a sprint race on the out lap! Come on, heat soak that intercooler! By the time we were at the green flag I think there was 8 or so car lengths between us and he was hanging it out trying to gap me. I pushed as hard as I could on the first timed lap and ran a 2:04 to Lewiz's 2:00. On lap 2 the ZR1 was cooking, the intercooler was heat-soaked, and I got a hasty point by into turn 3, which I took with a smile! Ed was hooting and hollering, saying that the announcer and the crowd was going nuts! "Pass him! Pass him!" I got around the ZR1 and opened up a huge gap. The ZR1 slowed to a 2:38 on lap two. Now that I was in the lead I drove like a man possessed, pushing to the limit, and the tires quickly overheated."
Vorshlag 2011 Mustang GT 5.0 - auto-x/track build - Page 15 - Corner-Carvers Forums​

their mustang has high end coilovers(since vorshlag is a dealer for AST and moton shocks), regular bolt ons under hood(intake, exhaust, tune, etc.), wheels and tires of course, and the 302LS splitter with a BIG rear wing.
the corvette ZR1 mentioned above is 100% fully BUILT by LG motorsports(lou gigliotti's shop - nothing more needs to be said). the engine is built, producing 8xxHP, it has suspension work, a big splitter and wing, wheels/tires, carbon ceramic brakes, etc.

needless to say, the LG motorsports ZR1 significantly outperforms vorshlag's mustang GT in every single performance metric - yet the mustang was running faster on lap 2 because the ZR1 heat soaked. the LG crew aren't idiots either, they've made cooling mods to the ZR1 and they've raced it in numerous events since 2009(IIRC), including setting the record at the spectre 341 hill climb.
just something to consider.

BTW, anyone considering tracking an S197, i'd suggest reading this thread from the beginning. LOTS of good info.

 

[svt boost]

Van,

I would be intersted to hear your opinion on a Boss VS 07-09 GT500 VS GRIGGS GT500 VS the 2013....once you get back from Sebring this weekend please give us your impressions!!!

I have been waiting to order a griggs for my 2007 vs sell it for a 2013

 

[Van@RevanRacing]

Van,

I would be intersted to hear your opinion on a Boss VS 07-09 GT500 VS GRIGGS GT500 VS the 2013....once you get back from Sebring this weekend please give us your impressions!!!

I have been waiting to order a griggs for my 2007 vs sell it for a 2013

Right now its hard to tell. The Griggs Chassis is so responsive as is the 2013 with the SVT Pack and Track Pack but the Griggs Chassis is a total transformation.

The Boss is an awesome car as well it simply doesn't have the power an torque of the GT500.

I love both of my cars but my Griggs TT GT500 is a totally different animal and it is difficult to draw a comparison. The Griggs suspension requires less input in the steering and is more responsive as a whole.

It really depends on what you are wanting to accomplish and what your individual goals are.

 

[Silver TT]

Great info in that thread on the S197. Thanks very much for posting.

 

[ReapeR948]

Right now its hard to tell. The Griggs Chassis is so responsive as is the 2013 with the SVT Pack and Track Pack but the Griggs Chassis is a total transformation.

The Boss is an awesome car as well it simply doesn't have the power an torque of the GT500.

I love both of my cars but my Griggs TT GT500 is a totally different animal and it is difficult to draw a comparison. The Griggs suspension requires less input in the steering and is more responsive as a whole.

It really depends on what you are wanting to accomplish and what your individual goals are.

can't wait to get mine to Griggs it the f out.

 

[modernbeat]

At the same event that we had the Vorshlag Mustang up against LG's ZR1, we were also running neck and neck with the Lingenfelter Camaro ZL1, another high horsepower car with a decent driver in it. The suspension we set up made up for a 250-300 hp deficit against the ZL1 and ZR1. If we had run better tires, I feel we would have been ahead of the ZL1 and nipping at Louis in the ZR1.

 

[Ry_Trapp0]

At the same event that we had the Vorshlag Mustang up against LG's ZR1, we were also running neck and neck with the Lingenfelter Camaro ZL1, another high horsepower car with a decent driver in it. The suspension we set up made up for a 250-300 hp deficit against the ZL1 and ZR1. If we had run better tires, I feel we would have been ahead of the ZL1 and nipping at Louis in the ZR1.

nice to see some of the vorshlag crew here, been following all the badass stuff you guys do over at C-C!
based on all of terry's comments about those tires, i don't doubt you for a second!

 

[specizripn]

If you read that article, the only reason the GT500 is slower than the ZL1 on the track repetitively is because of the lack of brake ducts, so the brakes dont cool properly and thus lap times slow down. So in my opinion you spend < $100 on brake duct tubing and either install/have installed and make your own brake cooling system. That will help the lap time consistency and now your GT500 is a track car Good Luck My Friend!

 

[Silver TT]

If you read that article, the only reason the GT500 is slower than the ZL1 on the track repetitively is because of the lack of brake ducts, so the brakes dont cool properly and thus lap times slow down. So in my opinion you spend < $100 on brake duct tubing and either install/have installed and make your own brake cooling system. That will help the lap time consistency and now your GT500 is a track car Good Luck My Friend!

If it only costs $100 to add brake ducts, kind of begs the question why Ford missed this?