Poor ZR-1 Owners

ArabianOak

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Didnt you trade a C6Z for a trike? What is the resale on that vs the zr1?

I made money on my Zr1. I paid 56K and got 60K trade on it toward the trike.

I got slightly more than I paid for the trike on trade...The trikes were 25k off when I bought mine, then 2 months before Campagna went bankrupt I traded it in on the Z06. The dealer lost a few k on my trike when that happened. Campagna then got bought by another company several months later and the values went up again.

That being said those are two very rare situations where I actually made out good!
 

Corbic

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I don't agree with your logic. If what you are saying is true, then '60s and early '70s Hemi Cudas, 427 Vettes, 396 Camaros, 428/351 Mustangs wouldn't be selling at the levels they are. Because so many current cars would destroy all of those, performance wise. Collectors don't buy Hemi Cudas for their "current day" performance values. They were low production high performance cars from those decades. The 1990 ZR1 was a low production high performance car from that decade. Superior to any other production car at the time. For whatever reason, it hasn't met expectations in future value. Maybe that will change some day. But for now, 30 years after it was launched, values are low. JMO.
You are missing his point.

While a ZR1 was impressive for 1990, it's not for today.

So that means it's only value is based on nostalgia and novelty.

They also produced 7k, almost all of which got stored as future collectables. This also means it's not even remotely rare. A MKIV Supra, only 12k Turbo models made it to the US for example and those have been used, abused, crashed, modded and destroyed. Good luck finding a factory original car.

A Hemi Cuda has become an icon for a bygone era. It has been built into a modern mythos to something far greater then it ever was. It's hyped, romanticized and fantasized about. It has prestige and symbology. It's highly sought after and collectable because it represents more then just a car. It's an emotion, it's art, it's America at its finest.

A C4 ZR1 is a cool foot note, but no one spent a decade dreaming of them, or making movies, magazines, articles and tributes to it.

It was a foot step on the road of progress, quickly replaced by something sleeker, faster and better designed.

A strong argument about classic muscle is they did not get replaced. Safety requirements set car aesthetics back by two decades. Emissions crippled performance for almost 30 years.

1971 Mustang 351 did the 1/4 in 13.9 seconds.

1973 we collapsed to 16.1, and in '74 a blistering 19.2 seconds.

It was not until 2003 that we would see a stock factory production Mustang break the 14 second barrier again, Mach 1 @ 13.9 (auto) 13.7 (manual).

And of course the car everyone still talks about, the 2003 SVT Cobra at 12.9 - effectively launching the last 20 years of ever increasingly more powerful cars.

Corvette, similar story.

1969 427 blazed to the 1/4 @ 13.9, spent the 70's as a 16 second car, 80's in the mid 14's. I'm showing the 1993 ZR1 ran an impressive 13.4.

But the C5 matched that at 13.1 in '97, C5Z ran 12.4 in' 01 and the current ZR1 is blasting sub 11's.

So are you dreaming about a C4ZR1 or a C8? Would you pick a C5ZR1 over a C2 Split Window?

Does the C4ZR1 have racing prestige and the universal love of a 911/964/993? What about an E30 M3?

Is it the everyman hero that every car enthusiast owned at one point in highschool like the Fox Body?

Personally, I see a Turbo 300ZX as a better built, styled and technologically more advanced car compared to a C4ZR1.
 
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ArabianOak

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I wonder if the C6 ZR1's will actually hold their value

It seems like it...mid 50's to low 60's the last few years....tons of car for the money but still turning into a dinosaur slowly. Furthermore I have been reading of the same heads issues like the C6z06 happening on these as well...people don't put miles on them so it took longer to see happening. Different engine, so im not sure why...
 

xblitzkriegx

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I see a lot of magazine times quoted in that reply. Nearly every car was faster than you specified, stock.

The 405hp ZR1s ran high 12s at real tracks while the 385hp versions ran 13 flat.

The L88 cars really did do high 11s/low 12s. What you dont see is that the mags from then spinning the tires through four gears.

Time always marches on. It's realistic to expect cars to be faster than the previous generation starting around the 2000s.

The base C5s were easy high 12 sec cars with a stick, all day long. Hell, the LS1 6M Camaros ran high 12s back then too.

I would argue that mustangs ran high 13s in the mid/late 80s and again in the 90s with the Cobras. Sure, it was relatively rare but it was far from impossible.

The ZR1 fell victim to old man hoarding mentality. I'm addition, I think the base models got a big power bump as well as getting the ZR1s tail lights towards the end. All that really made the ZR1 less important. Shame too, it's a lot morencar than people give it credit for.
 

Corbic

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I see a lot of magazine times quoted in that reply. Nearly every car was faster than you specified, stock.

Oh absolutely, but the same is true for vintage muscle. A manifold swap, carb tune, tire change.. Etc.

Magazine numbers are at least a consistent measure that be tracked easily unlike "real world" second hand accounts.

The times show the trend however. Cars dramatically improved from 1950 - > 1970. They got sleek, mean and stupid fast. Then everyone shit the bed in 1972 and it was easily 20, if not 30 years to return to those peak performance numbers in most cases.

Then in the 1980's we started seeing cars improve again and boom, since the mid 2000's they've exploded again.

We are in that 1965-1972 golden age again and it will likely end with Government forced electrification and explosion of driver aids.
 

03CRUSHER

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I wonder if the C6 ZR1's will actually hold their value

I’m currently in the market for one as it has always been my dream car. I sure hope it’s worth a ton down the road, but unlike most owners, mine will be driven regularly in fair weather! What a shame it would be to have owned a C4 ZR-1 for so long and not enjoyed it, and have to live with the fact that you lost your ass too in the process.
 

cidsamuth

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There is no doubt that the late 70s through the early 90s were dark times for American cars, and that has surely hampered values.

But, I think you guys are missing the "demand" part of the supply and demand equation. As a market wide assessment, men tend to start getting the expendable income for nostalgic purchases in their 50s. Those of us who were teens in the 80s are just now coming to that age. We have seen 70s cars start to creep up in value in recent years, and the 80s cars won't be far behind. Then, your early 90s specialty cars like the ZR1 will follow closely.

Not 63 Corvette Split Window kind of appreciation, but it will start to happen.
 

BlckBox04

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I’m currently in the market for one as it has always been my dream car. I sure hope it’s worth a ton down the road, but unlike most owners, mine will be driven regularly in fair weather! What a shame it would be to have owned a C4 ZR-1 for so long and not enjoyed it, and have to live with the fact that you lost your ass too in the process.

I almost bought a c6 ZR1 this winter also. I would drive it but honestly it would sit in my garage more often than not. but I'm also not the type of person to buy it, put it away and hope to score on it years down the road.
 

03CRUSHER

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I almost bought a c6 ZR1 this winter also. I would drive it but honestly it would sit in my garage more often than not. but I'm also not the type of person to buy it, put it away and hope to score on it years down the road.

For sure, same here. Someone already made the E30 M3, 911 argument and look at how much some of those higher mileage examples are going for. Insane. So, that’s why I plan to enjoy mine. And mod the shit out of it.
 

Corbic

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There is no doubt that the late 70s through the early 90s were dark times for American cars, and that has surely hampered values.

But, I think you guys are missing the "demand" part of the supply and demand equation. As a market wide assessment, men tend to start getting the expendable income for nostalgic purchases in their 50s. Those of us who were teens in the 80s are just now coming to that age. We have seen 70s cars start to creep up in value in recent years, and the 80s cars won't be far behind. Then, your early 90s specialty cars like the ZR1 will follow closely.

Not 63 Corvette Split Window kind of appreciation, but it will start to happen.
We've already seen this.. It's just not hitting the C4.

$100k for a '93 Cobra R.

$150k for 930s
$80k for 964s
$50k for 911s and E30 M3
$70k for Supras
$30k for FD3S
Rising prices on NSXs
A 240Z recently sold for stupid money on BAT.
328, 348 and Testarossa are finally rising in value.


Problem is this generation didn't grow up lusting for 3rd Gen Camaros, C4s, Supercharged Thunderbirds and G-bodies. I actually think Grand National values have dipped in recent years.. Likely because those fans are actually dying off now.

Remember, 65-73 Muscle exploded in the early 90's. Roughly 25-30 years later. We are now well past that for many cars in the 80's and even 90's.

C4 ZR1 is 30 years old. I'm sure someone with a full Hagerty account could look up what a 1966 C2 L72 was worth in 1996. I'm sure it was more then what a C4ZR1 is worth today.
 

earico

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You are missing his point.

While a ZR1 was impressive for 1990, it's not for today.

So that means it's only value is based on nostalgia and novelty.

They also produced 7k, almost all of which got stored as future collectables. This also means it's not even remotely rare. A MKIV Supra, only 12k Turbo models made it to the US for example and those have been used, abused, crashed, modded and destroyed. Good luck finding a factory original car.

A Hemi Cuda has become an icon for a bygone era. It has been built into a modern mythos to something far greater then it ever was. It's hyped, romanticized and fantasized about. It has prestige and symbology. It's highly sought after and collectable because it represents more then just a car. It's an emotion, it's art, it's America at its finest.

A C4 ZR1 is a cool foot note, but no one spent a decade dreaming of them, or making movies, magazines, articles and tributes to it.

It was a foot step on the road of progress, quickly replaced by something sleeker, faster and better designed.

A strong argument about classic muscle is they did not get replaced. Safety requirements set car aesthetics back by two decades. Emissions crippled performance for almost 30 years.

1971 Mustang 351 did the 1/4 in 13.9 seconds.

1973 we collapsed to 16.1, and in '74 a blistering 19.2 seconds.

It was not until 2003 that we would see a stock factory production Mustang break the 14 second barrier again, Mach 1 @ 13.9 (auto) 13.7 (manual).

And of course the car everyone still talks about, the 2003 SVT Cobra at 12.9 - effectively launching the last 20 years of ever increasingly more powerful cars.

Corvette, similar story.

1969 427 blazed to the 1/4 @ 13.9, spent the 70's as a 16 second car, 80's in the mid 14's. I'm showing the 1993 ZR1 ran an impressive 13.4.

But the C5 matched that at 13.1 in '97, C5Z ran 12.4 in' 01 and the current ZR1 is blasting sub 11's.

So are you dreaming about a C4ZR1 or a C8? Would you pick a C5ZR1 over a C2 Split Window?

Does the C4ZR1 have racing prestige and the universal love of a 911/964/993? What about an E30 M3?

Is it the everyman hero that every car enthusiast owned at one point in highschool like the Fox Body?

Personally, I see a Turbo 300ZX as a better built, styled and technologically more advanced car compared to a C4ZR1.

Supra numbers are actually about 12k for NA and Turbo. About 6k were Turbo. Should have never sold mine in the early 2000s but needed to a responsible dad. Also pulled on a C4 ZR1 back in the day in that car. Those were the days.
 

03Sssnake

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BlckBox04

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For sure, same here. Someone already made the E30 M3, 911 argument and look at how much some of those higher mileage examples are going for. Insane. So, that’s why I plan to enjoy mine. And mod the shit out of it.

there isn't a chance it would leave it stock either lol
 

xblitzkriegx

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Oh absolutely, but the same is true for vintage muscle. A manifold swap, carb tune, tire change.. Etc.

Magazine numbers are at least a consistent measure that be tracked easily unlike "real world" second hand accounts.

The times show the trend however. Cars dramatically improved from 1950 - > 1970. They got sleek, mean and stupid fast. Then everyone shit the bed in 1972 and it was easily 20, if not 30 years to return to those peak performance numbers in most cases.

Then in the 1980's we started seeing cars improve again and boom, since the mid 2000's they've exploded again.

We are in that 1965-1972 golden age again and it will likely end with Government forced electrification and explosion of driver aids.

I agree with everything you've said.
 

Klaus

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I almost bought a c6 ZR1 this winter also. I would drive it but honestly it would sit in my garage more often than not. but I'm also not the type of person to buy it, put it away and hope to score on it years down the road.

I think the c7z06 will hold up pretty well. I came close to bidding on a beautiful one with the zr1 brake and body package but passed. This is the apex C6 IMO.
 

BlckBox04

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I think the c7z06 will hold up pretty well. I came close to bidding on a beautiful one with the zr1 brake and body package but passed. This is the apex C6 IMO.

what made you pass
 

Weather Man

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Not enough room. I have two cars already, one of them is still not drivable. Already kicking myself since there are not many with that setup.

Ha! That is the problem, my 08 isn't being driven much with my 19 GT being so comfy and fun.
 

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