Returnless Fuel System

PSD_

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Hopefully I am posting this in the right spot. Bear with me as I am new to the forum. Is it possible to be returnless at the 650hp level? I am looking to get there without doing a return style fuel system. Is this possible with upgraded pumps, bap, and 60lb injectors? Thanks for the help.
 

MG0h3

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Sure. Not totally sure on the injectors but I think you can.

Plenty of us get up around 600rwhp on stock pumps and a bap. I went straight to ID1000s though so wait for another response on injectors


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olympic

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I have a returnless fuel system with dual GT supercar pumps and 650-700hp. Other than being close the the limit of what the pumps can supply(92% fuel pump duty cycle), I haven't had any issues.
 

blownstang4.6

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Will I need to upgrade my fdpm if I run the dual gt pumps? If so who makes an upgraded fdpm?

» Modified FPDM Black306.com

Sure is possible. The dual pumps will handle it. Might want to go larger than 60lb as around 700rwhp is the limit on pump gas. Your stock dual fpdms should be fine. When guys go from a single pump to dual pumps they'll either do a single modified fpdm or two stock fpdms. There are guys making 700rwhp returnless on E85, which means the fuel system needs to be able to support 900rwhp on pump gas.
 

KING_Asp

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I was at 713 rwhp on pump 93 with my car when it was returnless. It's a TVS 01 Cobra. My set up was running 72% FPDC and consisted of...
ID 1050X Injectors at 40 PSI
-8 AN feed Line
Stock Fuel Rails
Dual FPDM's
Twin GT (improved) Pumps in a Fore Innovations Hat
40 AMP BAP and upgraded wiring.

If your interested I have the dual FPDM harness for sale. I will give you a great deal on it and an additional FPDM.

All that said... The best mod I did to mine was to convert to a return system. Fuel delivery is ALWAYS a step behind in a returnless sytem.
 

01yellercobra

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I was at 713 rwhp on pump 93 with my car when it was returnless. It's a TVS 01 Cobra. My set up was running 72% FPDC and consisted of...
ID 1050X Injectors at 40 PSI
-8 AN feed Line
Stock Fuel Rails
Dual FPDM's
Twin GT (improved) Pumps in a Fore Innovations Hat
40 AMP BAP and upgraded wiring.

If your interested I have the dual FPDM harness for sale. I will give you a great deal on it and an additional FPDM.

All that said... The best mod I did to mine was to convert to a return system. Fuel delivery is ALWAYS a step behind in a returnless sytem.
Were you running torco?
 

Fooj

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Sorry to kinda hijack this thread but i figured this was better than creating a whole new one. Is it possible to run e85 on our cars without having a return style fuel system? What if you were just to upgrade the pumps and injectors could you run e85 without an issue?
 

KING_Asp

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Sorry to kinda hijack this thread but i figured this was better than creating a whole new one. Is it possible to run e85 on our cars without having a return style fuel system? What if you were just to upgrade the pumps and injectors could you run e85 without an issue?

Yes you can but it depends on how much power your trying to make. If you will be staying under 650 rwhp then you can make twin GT pumps and a BAP work with God's gift of E85. But by the time you get the pumps and other NECESSARY pieces it is same cost to switch to a budget return system that would support much more. Just remember on returnless systems that the pumps are a step behind on fuel delivery. You can over come that a little bit with bigger feed line and bigger fuel rails but you will still be a step behind what the motor needs. But... that being said, GT500's have returnless sytems and they make tons of power.

I can tell you that the stock fuel rails are no problem with E85. I currently make 790 RWHP through the stock fuel rails on my car. I have a return fuel system with twin 465's is a deadhead setup to the stock rails. I only drop 4-5 psi on a pull. I know this is not "ideal" but it works just fine and I have never gone lean on a run. I can only run the stock rails with the blower that I currently have on my car.
 

GodStang

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yep I ran for years on a few different setups at 650rw and 60s and over 700 and 80s on returnless and 93 octane.
 

PSD_

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So looks like a good route would be a fore hat with dual gt pumps and a second fpdm with wiring upgrade? Then if I want to bump up the power a bit more down the road I can throw in bigger injectors and a larger supply line. Any thing else that needs addressed with the fuel system besides the injectors and supply line?
 

KING_Asp

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So looks like a good route would be a fore hat with dual gt pumps and a second fpdm with wiring upgrade? Then if I want to bump up the power a bit more down the road I can throw in bigger injectors and a larger supply line. Any thing else that needs addressed with the fuel system besides the injectors and supply line?

That sounds like a good plan!! You will support the power with the 60lb injectors but you will have to increase the fuel pressure to get it. I would recommend a boost a pump for extra insurance since you will have to run more fuel pressure to stretch the 60's. You can twist the Hobbs switch/ trigger wires together since you will be returnless. That will give you another 40% or so on your pumps for added insurance. As you know... no fuel, no power, and no pistons left!!
 

KING_Asp

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The wires that run to the Hobbs switch to activate it. Its a black and red wire. That will keep it essentially on all the time. Since the returnless system modulates the pumps it works as a regulator to keep the voltage up. Ran my car for 6 years like that without a single issue.
 

c6zhombre

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It can be done returnless.....but in this day n age, a full return system is usually more cost effective and more tuners prefer it.

Having said that, my car has been returnless and at 714 wheel on E85 since 2009. And that's with the "old" GT supercar pumps that weren't even rated for ethanol. -8 feed, custom dual fpdm, factory rails, bap, upgraded wiring, fms 80s, stock maf w/mafia. Has run flawless for OVER TEN years. Pretty much 85% fpdc and 88% inj DC. Still fires first time every time and sits with E85 for months at a time.

Major props to 04sleeper for setting the bar. Been copied many times across the ford world.
 

PSD_

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On a side note does anyone have 04sleepers email? I have read a lot of good about his tuning and plan to use him in the future.
 

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