Thoughts on DCT

gimmie11s

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I clearly stated my point though. Halo to halo run it’ll have 140 in it the same night a demon runs 140 imo.

I’m expecting 131-137 to be the vast majority to halo area.

So you think it'll trap the same as the Demon on a hero run while being down ~80 horsepower but weighing the same or within 100 lbs of it? Demon weighs 4280 btw...

Interesting.
 

tt335ci03cobra

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So you think it'll trap the same as the Demon on a hero run while being down ~80 horsepower but weighing the same or within 100 lbs of it? Demon weighs 4280 btw...

Interesting.

Yes.

1. Whp will be much closer than the crank hp difference. Dct vs a8 is a 20whp saving to the gt500. Gt500 will likely dyno 700-720whp, hellcat demon does 760-770whp on racegas. Pump gas demon vs gt500 it’s all gt500 period. Don’t even bother trying to convince me otherwise.

2. Drag coefficient. Challenger demon widebody is .39, challenger hellcat redeye widebody is .40, Charger hellcat redeye is .35

The charger hellcat redeye probably has a 140mph trap in it on race gas with halo conditions much more often than the challenger. .05 cod at 130+ is a huge difference.

3. I’m a ford guy so obviously I’m biased. I love the hellcats and really love the charger hellcat. I’d love a hypothetical manual charger hellcat widebody redeye. It would be my daily driver, and I would love it, and pet it, and name it sam (warnerbro’s)
 
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tt335ci03cobra

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WTF is a



You cracking wise, son?

I want it to exist so bad... I’d give a lot of things for that

On the zl1 side, a 526hp gt350r was basically almost as quick as a 650hp zl1 on that motortrend test, like a under half second off at this track

012B589A-3059-4043-8E87-E7C2A694A77D.jpeg


Give the gt350r an extra 234hp, lots more torque, a dct, stickier tires, and 550lbs of downforce (insane), and it would be in supercar territory. I forgot the brakes, and the wider front track too.

Ya it’ll be ****tard fast. I’m more confident now than I was an hour ago.
 
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tt335ci03cobra

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Zl1 1le went 1:34.3 at Leguna.
9E9D6152-4112-47BD-BAD6-6AB679F6FF72.jpeg


Gt350r went 1:36.11

47A9DB24-645F-4A48-B6A6-43DC0D7EFDF4.jpeg


1.8 seconds is a hell of a lot at leguna seca, but there’s also a 125hp difference and I think the weights are dead even if not the 1le is lighter.

I think the gt500 with carbon track pack will have a sub 1:33 in it at Leguna.

Viper ACR went 1:31.xx, c6zr1 carbon went 1:32.

The new zr1 c7 went ??? I tried to find it but I don’t have motortrend on demand thing to see best drivers car. Anybody wanna share the lap time?
 
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Tob

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Nonetheless an FGT would absolutely murder a ZL1 1LE. It would not even be close.

LL times MURDER EH.JPG

Journalism majors and not professional drivers at LL, blah, blah, blah. Bottom line, hardly murder.

You said we'll find out in due time. I doubt that unless someone steps up and lets their GT get same day/driver tested with the 500.

I can't say it to you any other way. You'll just have to wait and see.
 

Tob

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And for some strange reason, none of the other cars were?

Note it is within a couple seconds of another timed run.
 

Klaus

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View attachment 1586769
Journalism majors and not professional drivers at LL, blah, blah, blah. Bottom line, hardly murder.



I can't say it to you any other way. You'll just have to wait and see.

Any explanation why there are two times for FGT? Both are 2017. Also, ZR1 on top of a 720s? Hmmm
 
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gimmie11s

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Yes.

1. Whp will be much closer than the crank hp difference. Dct vs a8 is a 20whp saving to the gt500. Gt500 will likely dyno 700-720whp, hellcat demon does 760-770whp on racegas. Pump gas demon vs gt500 it’s all gt500 period. Don’t even bother trying to convince me otherwise.

2. Drag coefficient. Challenger demon widebody is .39, challenger hellcat redeye widebody is .40, Charger hellcat redeye is .35

The charger hellcat resets probably has a 140mph trap in it on race gas with halo conditions much more often than the challenger. .05 cod at 130+ is a huge difference.

3. I’m a ford guy so obviously I’m biased. I love the hellcats and really love the charger hellcat. I’d love a manual charger hellcat widebody redeye. It would be my daily driver, and I would love it, and pet it, and name it sam (warnerbro’s)

I can accept the “Ford guy” bias... the rest? Nah.

The gt500 won’t be a 140 car just like the demon isn’t a 140 car.

The new gt500 will be a solid low-mid 130s car.

The 13/14 cars routinely ran mid 120’s. Like 125-127. Some woefully lower, but mid 120s on average.


It’s just too heavy (unless ford absolutely shocks all of us with a sub 4000 car—not!).

Any gains by the DCT will be made up by better gearing and not equally but still very fast shifting a8 Demon.


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tt335ci03cobra

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I can accept the “Ford guy” bias... the rest? Nah.

The gt500 won’t be a 140 car just like the demon isn’t a 140 car.

The new gt500 will be a solid low-mid 130s car.

The 13/14 cars routinely ran mid 120’s. Like 125-127. Some woefully lower, but mid 120s on average.


It’s just too heavy (unless ford absolutely shocks all of us with a sub 4000 car—not!).

Any gains by the DCT will be made up by better gearing and not equally but still very fast shifting a8 Demon.


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You keep your opinions, I’ve said mine. Car has a good chance to hit 140 in perfect conditions. We’ll see 137 quickly just like the demon saw.

I’ve already said the average range is gonna be 133-137 imo.

Anything over 130 is fast, let’s not kid ourselves.

•drag coefficent
•powertrain loss
•ford bias
There’s a lot of competitive edge there.

Also the demon falls off on power after 6500. The gt500 will pull to 8k and makes 760hp at 7500. Engine is likely underrated and makes closer to 775-790 imo.

12psi 2.65 tvs, [email protected]/1, aggressive dohc heads/cams, come on with 760hp.

You really think a 9.5/1 8000rpm 5.2L Dohc gen 3 coyote engine is only going to make 380whp or rather 419hp engine hp?

(12/14.7)+1= 1.816

1.816*419= 760hp

Spare me, there’s no way that engine is less power dense than my modular 9.3/1 5.3 that makes about 450whp na with a damn fr500c, not some 7” runner sheetmetal deal.

My bet is the engine makes about 800 crank hp.
 
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gimmie11s

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Engine is likely underrated and makes closer to 775-790 imo.

12psi 2.65 tvs, [email protected]/1, aggressive dohc heads/cams, come on with 760hp.

Pure conjecture based in nothing.

A large blower takes power to spin. Compression is not aggressive ... rest of the package is basic coyote/voodoo shelf parts (largely) that we’ve had for several years.

It’s not underrated, nor was the 13/14 car, nor was the 18 gen 3.


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tt335ci03cobra

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Pure conjecture based in nothing.

A large blower takes power to spin. Compression is not aggressive ... rest of the package is basic coyote/voodoo shelf parts (largely) that we’ve had for several years.

It’s not underrated, nor was the 13/14 car, nor was the 18 gen 3.


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2.65 is not a big blower. It maybe saps 40hp to spin 7k rpm. Big whipped 3.6’s only eat about 75hp at 12-15psi.

Difference of 9.5/1 compression and 11/1 is about 3% per entire point. As in 4.5%

Call it 5%. 5% of 500hp is 25 hp.

I think the voodoo is 12/1 so 2.5*3=7%

7% of 500hp is 35hp. Big stinking whoop man. It’s decent compression for boost... I did gross math too, not net.

I’ve said my peace. I’m not mad or put off by your posts, I hope you aren’t by mine. Beer
 
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gofast15

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Zl1 1le went 1:34.3 at Leguna.View attachment 1586765

Gt350r went 1:36.11

View attachment 1586768

1.8 seconds is a hell of a lot at leguna seca, but there’s also a 125hp difference and I think the weights are dead even if not the 1le is lighter.

I think the gt500 with carbon track pack will have a sub 1:33 in it at Leguna.

Viper ACR went 1:31.xx, c6zr1 carbon went 1:32.

The new zr1 c7 went ??? I tried to find it but I don’t have motortrend on demand thing to see best drivers car. Anybody wanna share the lap time?

C6 ZR1 - 1:33.7
C7 ZR1 - 1:32.4

Laguna Seca (post 1988) lap times - FastestLaps.com
 

tt335ci03cobra

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gofast15

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Wow the older acr did 1:31.x

It’s not slow but 1:32.4 is longer than I expected. I think the zr1 is dealing with too much torque for the rear end to handle. When I watched the Randy Phobst vid review at willow springs I was surprised how loose the rear was even with a huge rear wing.
No , it was a gen V ACR . you can click on the car or the time in the previous link I posted , it shows all the specs
Dodge Viper ACR Mk V laptimes, specs, performance data - FastestLaps.com
 

tt335ci03cobra

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No , it was a gen V ACR . you can click on the car or the time in the previous link I posted , it shows all the specs
Dodge Viper ACR Mk V laptimes, specs, performance data - FastestLaps.com

Correct, older as in older than the c7 zr1.

Last gen c6 zr1 was no slouch if it was only outdone by 1.3 seconds.
•638hp vs 755hp
•downforce vs DOWNFORCE
•c6 vs c7 chassis

I bet the c7 zr1 is much faster on slicks than it is on street tires. Much more so than the c6 difference would have been. Car needs some gumball at the rear.

I think the c7 zR1 is to loose at the tail to handle 715tq. The c6 z06 z07 (505hp) ran 1:34.43, and the c7 corvette grand sport went 1:35.62.

The 350r going 1:36.11 means it was 1/2 second off the c7 grand sport. That’s damn close for:

3450 vs 3750 lbs
1.18g skidpad vs 1.

CA131CC2-5448-49C6-A040-9FE9DCC9D2E5.jpeg

CF7536DB-FF45-4D85-AFBA-10B744D922CC.jpeg


In this case, the difference was 1:36.02 grand sport vs 1:36.11 gt350r

It’s that the gt350r is easier to get most of the full potential out of.

The corvette according to Randy is paraphrasing “got a hinge in it, and has for 35 years since the c4. The nose turns in and sticks but the tail doesn’t follow it, and comes loose.”
 
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