Anyone else frustrated with Ford over the next GT500?

Tob

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The patent findings have definitely piqued my interest in who is doing what and how far Ford may go with this car in search of performance. And while rumors of some fairly lofty weight numbers are being tossed around, my interest lies in the attempts to keep the fat trimmed as much as possible.

The CF wheels from Carbon Revolution were a major advancement and I'd hope they are tapped again. The question remains as to how much cost reduction has been possible what with the benefit of increased economies of scale along with recent technological developments. The composite GOR (or grill opening reinforcement) on the GT350 was a pretty big feat a few years ago. In searching for more data on Magna and BASF, two big players in the area of composites and lightweighting, I found an older video on the GOR I hadn't seen before.


I never knew the part was molded in two pieces and then fused to make one. And to what DBK intimated, Ford is indeed in search of weight savings at every corner. This piece saved 2.5lbs over it's metal stamped predecessor and an additional 1.9lbs was saved by eliminating the "beauty cover." My only gripe - the "carbon-fiber composite" raised lettering. I know it was new to many and as such Ford felt the need to show how proud they were. Much like putting "wheel" on a wheel or "tire" on a tire, I hope this ends. A simple request.:) Anyway, at the end of the above video it is mentioned that BASF/Magna were working with Ford on upcoming GOR/front end modules as well as active aero and active grills, exactly what the patents of a few pages back showed.

Magna and Cosma have also been working with Ford on composite subframes. It looks as though much of the development focused of Fusion related hardware but with that car going away it would seem reasonable that the Mustang could take advantage as well.


Magna%20composite%20subframe-XL.jpg

Magna%20composite%20subframe1-M.jpg

Magna%20composite%20subframe2-M.jpg


A good read on the above.
Teaming to define what automotive CFRP could be

It looks as though Ford has been testing the subframes for the past year.

The design has passed all performance requirements based on computer aided engineering (CAE) analyses, and vehicle level testing is underway at Ford. The testing phase will evaluate corrosion, stone chipping and bolt load retention, which are not currently measured by CAE.
Will Ford's composites move finally crack the automotive industry's throughput dilemma?

My only concern is that it is way too early and that Ford will continue and test such that this technology might show up on an SUV or truck down the road. Maybe even the S650 Mustang - if that one ends up ever happening. Then again, the following quote gives me hope for 2020, even if only a little.

According to Andrew Swikoski, Magna’s global product line director for lightweight composites, Ford intends to make a decision on whether or not to mass produce the subframe by the end of 2018. He told Automotive News that the subframe will need to be combined with metals to help absorb impact. Currently, the subframe absorbs about five percent of crash energy and resorts to dropping the engine below the vehicle in a collision.

“It’s not meant to be a primary crash absorber,” said Swikoski.
Magna Delivers Prototype of Composite Subframe to Ford

I also pray this car doesn't have the uber annoying start/stop "feature."
weight%20savings%20analyses-XL.jpg
 

AustinSN

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sure, lots of blower cars heat soak during hot day sessions more so than NA cars, whats more to elaborate on? the vipers, GT3 porsches, NA vettes seem to be zero issue lapping all day. Really wish I'd see someone out there with a gt350... Austin....

You and me both buddy.
 

biminiLX

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No wonder the GT500 was not available a year after they finished the GT350....
No wonder they didn't just throw a supercharger and automatic in a GT350 while they worked on whatever this car will be....
I mean it's not like you can sell a GT350 and GT500 at the same time.
-J
 

Tob

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Dunno how the GT350 will live on if the Niche line stops producing it's engine. Still waiting for confirmation either way. You'd think that the revisions for the '19 GT350 would mean at least a couple of more years but who knows at this point.
 

conceptmachine

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What were the upgrades on the GT350 for '19 MY, i've been out for a while? If they can be used on the GT500, I can see where the costs of producing these parts were justified, without making a 2020 GT350.
I thought it was mentioned, the 350 would live along side the GT500, but this was over a year ago.
 

Voltwings

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Dunno how the GT350 will live on if the Niche line stops producing it's engine. Still waiting for confirmation either way. You'd think that the revisions for the '19 GT350 would mean at least a couple of more years but who knows at this point.

You think they'll stop making that engine? Seems like a lot of R&D down the drain, because i don't feel like they're going to get their money back off just a few years of a halo vehicle. Unless it was really just a test bench for heads, cams, and other items that will live on, which seems a likely case as well.
 

Tob

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What were the upgrades on the GT350 for '19 MY, i've been out for a while?
2019 Ford Mustang Shelby GT350 Gets an Update - Motor Trend

And yes, there have been some from Ford quoted such that it appears both will be available at the same "time."

You think they'll stop making that engine? Seems like a lot of R&D down the drain, because i don't feel like they're going to get their money back off just a few years of a halo vehicle. Unless it was really just a test bench for heads, cams, and other items that will live on, which seems a likely case as well.
I suppose every modular iteration has been a test bench for the next one. As for when the line will cease to produce the GT350 engine as we currently know it...look to plant operations/UAW agreements for a sense that hasn't been clear from Ford. The '13-'14 5.8 GT500 powerplant was quite an improvement over earlier versions and it only lasted 2 years. With this new CEO...hard to gauge.

And because I'm bored and haven't been able to dig much of anything up in the past few days how about a bit of a reach. Remember the silly CGI video from earlier this year? Pay attention (again:)) at about the :23 second mark...


Did you catch the illuminated flame front?

GT500%20exhaust-X4.jpg


Cheesy? Is this something some of you might want? If you do, it looks like Ford has this one covered. US Patent #9,464,776 B2 "Vehicle Lighting System With Illuminating Exhaust" looks to be the hot ticket (pun intended).

GT500%20exhaust%20illuminati%20detail-M.jpg


The patent...
Patent Images
 

Zemedici

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No wonder they didn't just throw a supercharger and automatic in a GT350 while they worked on whatever this car will be....
I mean it's not like you can sell a GT350 and GT500 at the same time.
-J

Boss 302 / GT500?

Or did you just zing me with your sarcasm, J?
 

DepWraith

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Do you know what flame front means?

Hint...


Yes, it is the region of space where the combustion reaction takes place. It appears we are seeing the flame back in that animated video given our view from outside the exhaust chambers.
 
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conceptmachine

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Upgrades on the 350 look fairly trivial to me. don't see anything that screams $$ that couldn't be recouped in 1 MY and ford performance parts sales. That said, I think there will be a 2020 350. possibly only for the first 1/2 of 2020, until the gt500 starts being spit out in larger numbers.
 

1 Alibi 2

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You think they'll stop making that engine? Seems like a lot of R&D down the drain, because i don't feel like they're going to get their money back off just a few years of a halo vehicle. Unless it was really just a test bench for heads, cams, and other items that will live on, which seems a likely case as well.
.
11/12 GT500 5.4 - 2 year run
13/14 GT500 5.8 - 2 year run
 

Voltwings

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11/12 GT500 5.4 - 2 year run
13/14 GT500 5.8 - 2 year run

True, but in some form or fashion that engine dates back to like the early 2000s. I know the Voodoo wasn't 100% built from scratch, but there were quite a few new, bespoke, pieces.
 

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