Brakes?

termcobra281

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Just wondering if a person can get a upgraded front brake only set up for our 03/04 cobras? since most our brake power is in the front it would be nice to upgrade to a good front set up... but the only thing I have seen was whole kits? Thanks for any input.
 

KyleSVT

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Your gonna want to upgrade the front and do the 13inch rear upgrade as well. I'm working with FTBR right now with a new 14inch 4 piston wilwood front upgrade kit. Have to break them in and do a little R&D then they will be selling the kit
 

blownfox

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If you go 14 inch up front you will need 18 inch wheels. Baer makes a 6 piston caliper that will work with stock wheels and rotors. A lot of members just upgrade lines, pads, rotors, and change the brake fluid.
 

94slowbra1

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I run the 14" brembo GT kit on the front. For the rear I have upgraded to stainless lines and 2pc rotor. The performance is great. Eventually I'll upgrade to a 13" rear but that is strictly for astehetics.
 

99 KOBRA

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Upgrading the rears is a waste of money. Put Stop Tech 13" brakes up front with steel-braided lines front/rear and you're good to go. There are lots of good pads to choose from. For open track, Porterfield R4's are killer!!!!
 

ac427cobra

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Upgrading the rears is a waste of money.

I would agree with this only if you are talking about staying with a 13" front brake.

Two factors come into play with brakes, #1 rotor diameter which relates to leverage advantage and clamping force which relates to piston diameter and piston count. When Ford came out with the 2007 Shelby GT500 it had 110 more HP than the last SVT offering which was the Terminator. This increase in power along with the additional vehicle weight dictated why the Shelby came from the factory with a 14" front rotor diameter and four piston fixed Brembo calipers. This matched the required braking capacity to the vehicle. Much like when the 2013 Shelby GT 500 came out with 162 additional horsepower over the last Shelby GT500 offering, front rotor diameter once again was upgraded to 15" and the calipers went from four piston to six piston fixed to be able to stop the much more powerful and heavier vehicle. This is also the reason the rear brake rotors on the latest Shelby GT500 went from 12.8" to 13.75" diameter to keep the front/rear bias where it needed to be.

These year by year brake upgrades brings us to the latest offering, the Shelby GT350. It has 15.5" diameter front rotors with 6 piston fixed Brembo calipers and 15" rear rotors with four piston fixed Brembo calipers. This latest Shelby offering has the best brakes to ever come from Ford on a Mustang including previous Ford Racing competition vehicles. (prior to the GT 350)

Some people are under the impression that the front Cobra OEM PBR calipers with 13" rotors are good brakes. In reality, they are just barely adequate to pass minimum safety standards which is why they came as standard equipment on these vehicles. A two piston floating caliper like the PBR caliper is half as efficient as a four piston fixed caliper when it comes to clamping force.

A 14" four piston fixed caliper with be a significant front brake upgrade for any SN-95 vehicle because you will be upgrading both diameter and clamping force. This translates to less pedal travel and less pedal pressure/effort for everyday driving along with eyeball popping stopping power when you need it.

A 14" front brake upgrade does require 18" wheels. Once the front brakes have been upgraded to a 14" four piston setup the rear brakes will be under biased. The 11.6" will be carrying a very small portion of the braking load which is why we developed our 13" rear brake conversion kit to put the front/rear brake bias back where it needs to be. A Mustang with this brake set-up will stop more like a Corvette than a Mustang.
 

TexaSTI

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I would agree with this only if you are talking about staying with a 13" front brake.

Two factors come into play with brakes, #1 rotor diameter which relates to leverage advantage and clamping force which relates to piston diameter and piston count. When Ford came out with the 2007 Shelby GT500 it had 110 more HP than the last SVT offering which was the Terminator. This increase in power along with the additional vehicle weight dictated why the Shelby came from the factory with a 14" front rotor diameter and four piston fixed Brembo calipers. This matched the required braking capacity to the vehicle. Much like when the 2013 Shelby GT 500 came out with 162 additional horsepower over the last Shelby GT500 offering, front rotor diameter once again was upgraded to 15" and the calipers went from four piston to six piston fixed to be able to stop the much more powerful and heavier vehicle. This is also the reason the rear brake rotors on the latest Shelby GT500 went from 12.8" to 13.75" diameter to keep the front/rear bias where it needed to be.

These year by year brake upgrades brings us to the latest offering, the Shelby GT350. It has 15.5" diameter front rotors with 6 piston fixed Brembo calipers and 15" rear rotors with four piston fixed Brembo calipers. This latest Shelby offering has the best brakes to ever come from Ford on a Mustang including previous Ford Racing competition vehicles. (prior to the GT 350)

Some people are under the impression that the front Cobra OEM PBR calipers with 13" rotors are good brakes. In reality, they are just barely adequate to pass minimum safety standards which is why they came as standard equipment on these vehicles. A two piston floating caliper like the PBR caliper is half as efficient as a four piston fixed caliper when it comes to clamping force.

A 14" four piston fixed caliper with be a significant front brake upgrade for any SN-95 vehicle because you will be upgrading both diameter and clamping force. This translates to less pedal travel and less pedal pressure/effort for everyday driving along with eyeball popping stopping power when you need it.

A 14" front brake upgrade does require 18" wheels. Once the front brakes have been upgraded to a 14" four piston setup the rear brakes will be under biased. The 11.6" will be carrying a very small portion of the braking load which is why we developed our 13" rear brake conversion kit to put the front/rear brake bias back where it needs to be. A Mustang with this brake set-up will stop more like a Corvette than a Mustang.

I enjoyed reading all that info. Now I have a question that I hope isn't derailing this thread: If you upgrade just the front brake calipers on these cars to 6 piston, how will it handle leaving the stock rear calipers? Will it be overly biased like you talk about?
 

ac427cobra

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I enjoyed reading all that info. Now I have a question that I hope isn't derailing this thread: If you upgrade just the front brake calipers on these cars to 6 piston, how will it handle leaving the stock rear calipers? Will it be overly biased like you talk about?

It is OK to be over biased towards the front but not the other way around. The 2007 and up Shelby GT 500's and Brembo optioned cars came like that from the factory. If you over bias the rear that is when you can have issues. If you over bias the front, you are simply making your rear brakes less effective in relation to a front to rear percentage basis.

Here is a quick little video we put together at the last minute before impending snow. Next Spring we hope to do a much more comprehensive test all of the way to a complete stop for comparison purposes. This video compares the stopping power of our 14" front Big Brake 4 piston Wilwood kit on Kyle's Terminator to a Stock 1999 Saleen. As you can see, the difference in stopping power is dramatic.


You just missed the sale on this 14" four piston big brake kit for $1,195.00 with free shipping. Everything in the photo below including st. st. braided lines is included in the kit.

FT_9496-SN-95_Wilwood_Front_Brake_kit.jpg


There is a chance we will have a Christmas Sale on this kit again so stay tuned to our web site.
 

jrgoffin

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Upgrading the rears is a waste of money. Put Stop Tech 13" brakes up front with steel-braided lines front/rear and you're good to go. There are lots of good pads to choose from. For open track, Porterfield R4's are killer!!!!

This is absolutely the way to go for probably 99% of the Cobra owners out there - an upgraded front caliper. They obviously must be accompanied by good pads, rotors, and of course, quality tires, but most have no need for larger rotors up front. Baer makes a fantastic caliper in both 4- and 6-piston that mate well to their two-piece (lighter) rotors that can be added to all four corners.

Some people are under the impression that the front Cobra OEM PBR calipers with 13" rotors are good brakes. In reality, they are just barely adequate to pass minimum safety standards which is why they came as standard equipment on these vehicles. A two piston floating caliper like the PBR caliper is half as efficient as a four piston fixed caliper when it comes to clamping force.

Just because the PBR calipers have two pistons vs. four (i.e., "half"), does not mean they are half as efficient. The reality is that those calipers are actually decent for most of the cars out there, and the stopping distances they provide are not substantially reduced compared to something like the '00R Brembo caliper. What is improved is feel and resistance to fade due to the solid (axial) mounting.

Here's a chart right from the '00R program (that is on my site), comparing the 'early' PBR calipers with the 38mm pistons, to the 'late' versions with 40mm pistons (same as on the Terminator), as well as the Brembo set:

R_Braking.jpg
 

TexaSTI

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It is OK to be over biased towards the front but not the other way around. The 2007 and up Shelby GT 500's and Brembo optioned cars came like that from the factory. If you over bias the rear that is when you can have issues. If you over bias the front, you are simply making your rear brakes less effective in relation to a front to rear percentage basis.

Here is a quick little video we put together at the last minute before impending snow. Next Spring we hope to do a much more comprehensive test all of the way to a complete stop for comparison purposes. This video compares the stopping power of our 14" front Big Brake 4 piston Wilwood kit on Kyle's Terminator to a Stock 1999 Saleen. As you can see, the difference in stopping power is dramatic.


You just missed the sale on this 14" four piston big brake kit for $1,195.00 with free shipping. Everything in the photo below including st. st. braided lines is included in the kit.

View attachment 1531706

There is a chance we will have a Christmas Sale on this kit again so stay tuned to our web site.

Thanks for the reply Bruce! I actually already watched that video when it got posted. Great info and I think the kit looks great for the money!

I already ordered 6 piston fixed calipers for the front. I was just making sure the cars characteristics wouldn't become bad. What I would really like is a rear fixed caliper kit that isn't a big 4/6pot and doesn't break the bank and over bias the rear.


Oh I also just ordered the toe link/bumpsteer kit from your company! Can't wait to dial it in.



[bcolor=transparent]
This is absolutely the way to go for probably 99% of the Cobra owners out there - an upgraded front caliper. They obviously must be accompanied by good pads, rotors, and of course, quality tires, but most have no need for larger rotors up front. Baer makes a fantastic caliper in both [bcolor=transparent]4-[/bcolor] and [bcolor=transparent]6-piston[/bcolor] that mate well to their two-piece (lighter) rotors that can be added to all four corners.[/bcolor]
[bcolor=transparent][/bcolor]
[bcolor=transparent]
This is what I did. 2 piece Eradispeed rotors on all corners and their 6piston pro caliper up front. What is really cool is the caliper works with both 13 and 14 in rotors so there is room for growth and what not.[/bcolor][/quote]
 

ac427cobra

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The problem with Cobra OEM PBR calipers is they 'clamshell' under heavy loads and high heat. A four piston fixed caliper will ALWAYS be more efficient than a two piston floating caliper. Adding larger diameter rotors increases braking 'leverage' which is key to increased braking efficiency and reduced stopping distances.
 

94slowbra1

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I'm amazed by all the people that build high hp "street" cars that leave the factory brakes in place. Why? Buy the best brakes you have the cash for especially if your going fast.
I have had the baer 13" 6 piston set up with 2pc rotors and I can tell you without a doubt my 4 piston 14" brembo kit is much better. Sure it's a heavier rotor but being a 2pc design it's not by much. And I'd rather have a little more rotational weight and be able to stop then save the couple lbs.
 

TexaSTI

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I'm amazed by all the people that build high hp "street" cars that leave the factory brakes in place. Why? Buy the best brakes you have the cash for especially if your going fast.
I have had the baer 13" 6 piston set up with 2pc rotors and I can tell you without a doubt my 4 piston 14" brembo kit is much better. Sure it's a heavier rotor but being a 2pc design it's not by much. And I'd rather have a little more rotational weight and be able to stop then save the couple lbs.


Stepping up to a 14" rotor really stops better than 13" with a bigger caliper (larger pad?). I am still a scrub who is just learning about brakes lol. Starting to have regrets doing a 6 piston on a 13".
 

me32

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This is absolutely the way to go for probably 99% of the Cobra owners out there - an upgraded front caliper. They obviously must be accompanied by good pads, rotors, and of course, quality tires, but most have no need for larger rotors up front. Baer makes a fantastic caliper in both 4- and 6-piston that mate well to their two-piece (lighter) rotors that can be added to all four corners.



Just because the PBR calipers have two pistons vs. four (i.e., "half"), does not mean they are half as efficient. The reality is that those calipers are actually decent for most of the cars out there, and the stopping distances they provide are not substantially reduced compared to something like the '00R Brembo caliper. What is improved is feel and resistance to fade due to the solid (axial) mounting.

Here's a chart right from the '00R program (that is on my site), comparing the 'early' PBR calipers with the 38mm pistons, to the 'late' versions with 40mm pistons (same as on the Terminator), as well as the Brembo set:

View attachment 1531709
There was not a 2000 cobra. Only a 2000 Cobra R. You sure it wasnt a 1999 or 2001
 

me32

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The problem with Cobra OEM PBR calipers is they 'clamshell' under heavy loads and high heat. A four piston fixed caliper will ALWAYS be more efficient than a two piston floating caliper. Adding larger diameter rotors increases braking 'leverage' which is key to increased braking efficiency and reduced stopping distances.

Bruce whats your take on the 2000 cobra R front brake kit? I had that on my 2003 cobra vert. Was night and day for braking performance. I always thought the stock 03/04 cobra brakes were very under performaning for the speed and weight it had.
 

94slowbra1

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i dont have any factual data, cones, measurements ect... but i would definitely say yes. my car reels back in very quick. to me the braking confidence and feel is the best part about the 14" set up. it never feels like its on the edge, i just seems easy
like i said i ran the baer 6p set up with their 2pc eradispeed rotors. i broke them in according to the directions and all. yes they stopped better but i wanted more (especially for when i do high speed runs at 150+). i spoke many times with bruce at FTBR and folks over at MM about stepping up to a 14" set up. i ultimately went with the 14" brembo GT kit (same basic brembo kit as what bruce sells except the rotors are a different brand). once broken in i noticed a big difference when laying into the brakes. they are down right violent when warm and you stab them. paired with good pads, good fluid and stainless lines i cant see a better set up except for maybe adding his 13" rear kit to compliment it.

Stepping up to a 14" rotor really stops better than 13" with a bigger caliper (larger pad?). I am still a scrub who is just learning about brakes lol. Starting to have regrets doing a 6 piston on a 13".

dont have regrets. use them and if it turns out they arent enough for what you do then sell them and step up. if you do eventually step up to a bigger rotor i highly suggest a 2pc design. a 1pc 14" rotor is going to be heavy
 

termcobra281

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This post was very interesting and I have learned some things, my problem is I have 17 inch racestars on the front with 15 inch racestars in the rear.... not much room for these big brakes.. with that said I have had motorcycles which most braking power was in the front so I'd say a well built brake system on the front for a mostly street driven car will do all I need and maybe some 8th mile drag
 

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